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Paul Raven, the bassist known for his work with Killing Joke and Prong, is discussing life on the road with Ministry.
"We all love country music," he says. "You wouldn't imagine that we sit in the back lounge of the bus playing pedal-steel with cowboy hats on, but actually quite a lot of that goes on.
"There's something about the purity and clarity of that kind of music: It embodies certain values and has an innocence to it that I think is missing in a lot of people's lives."
He's right. Many a myth has been built around Al Jourgensen and his ever-changing cast of bandmates over the past 25 years. But cowboy hat-wearing, pedal steel-playing crooner of odes to lost innocence has never been one of them.
This, after all, is the man behind Ministry, the band almost single-handedly responsible for dragging aggressive, industrial music into the mainstream.
The man more at home in The Land of Rape and Honey than in a Tennessee mountain home. The man whose still-chilling 1988 masterpiece Stigmata unwittingly launched a thousand similar-sounding punk/industrial/ dance/goth songs by his dark disciples. The other man in black.
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Ah, but neither Jourgensen nor Ministry is about to buy into such constricting presumptions, Raven asserts. "I don't think they really mean anything, to be honest," he says of the industrial tag his band Killing Joke has likewise endured for decades.
"My idea of industrial music is, like, Test Department and Einstuerzende Neubauten and people banging on big chunks of metal. That's my idea of it -- not using conventional instruments.
"With a lot of things that pass themselves off as so-called 'industrial' music, there's a distinct lack of originality; it's regurgitating and recycling the same old beats and samples.
"I just find I'd rather listen to a beer can in the washing machine. A lot of it leaves me completely cold.
"What separates Ministry from what I refer to as 'disco' -- you know, where there's just a machine running and everyone jams along with it -- is all of our samples and all of what you would presume to be sequencing, are actually all played. There's a human element to it.
"And even though there are samples, we're not tagging along to a click-track. We are, in a lot of ways, a lot more organic than what I would consider to be true industrial music."
By we, Raven is referring to himself, Jourgensen and the latest incarnation of Ministry's touring band -- guitarists Tommy Victor and Mike Scaccia, keyboardist John Bechdel and drummer Joey Jordison. It's a mix of Ministry veterans and newcomers. Remarkably, given the similar career path he has followed since joining England's legendary aggression kings Killing Joke some 25 years ago.
"Al and I have been friends for all that time," Raven says. "And Killing Joke has done shows with Ministry or with Revolting Cocks (Jourgensen's ongoing side project that will see him doing double duty at Friday's Capital Music Hall show). We have many, many mutual friends and interests; so, it was really only a matter of time before we combined forces. Finally we're both in the same place."
Ironically, that inevitable partnership has come at the expense of Killing Joke, who were left scrambling for a touring bassist as they prepared to tour in the wake of a recently released album. Raven calls the timing "unfortunate" but like a good soldier felt compelled to "fulfill my commitment to Ministry."
After all, there will be other Killing Joke tours. And there are already enough misunderstandings surrounding "the big two," as Raven calls the bands. Which, of course, brings us back to the tour bus. And the cowboy hats.
"It's very easy for me," Raven says. "There are two types of music: Good music and bad music. You know, I'm not into pop music, but I know a good pop song when I hear it.
"And I think people who may not necessarily be into what is referred to as 'industrial' music or who would never buy something in a 'goth' section will accept Ministry in different contexts.
"I think we're pretty broadly accepted by metal people, by rock people ... both Killing Joke and Ministry. And we're not out there to make any new friends or impress anyone anymore, so it's take it or leave it. But we'll try and make sure that you take it."